President Race for 2008!

[||§§||Foehammer]

Screw McCain.
Fuck Obama.


Vote Cobra Commander!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzrd6eVAsjA

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

Especially if Munn is his running mate

Bow Chicka Bow Wow

[||§§||Foehammer]

High Five Hand!

[||§§||Reign]

Well I like the McCain guy. Sorry but the other guy gets in He will get shot by some Crazy White Nazi Group. So lets just get the old fart in and get it over with!

[||§§||RENÔTŠΩ]

Well I like the McCain guy. Sorry but the other guy gets in He will get shot by some Crazy White Nazi Group. So lets just get the old fart in and get it over with!

lol thats what i was bettin on if obama won the election, but either way i think the country and economy is going to go down hill for awhile. it might be time to move haha

[||§§||Kit]

Yeah, but where to go?

[||§§||Dr.H]

I'm not a political person but if you want to keep your rights then vote McCain and keep the fanatical celebrity Obama out of the White House!!

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

McCain is just a more trust worthy guy. Obama plays all sides of the fence just for votes, you have no idea where he stands on anything and he has no idea how to handle the US's energy problem.

[||§§||RENÔTŠΩ]

i agree 100% with hand. obama is just way to inexperienced for this job.

[Nightmare]

eh... i don't any of them. if i could vote tho, i would vote for McCain.

or even Nader!!! lol

[||§§||Kit]

or even Nader!!! lol

What a waste of a vote! I'd rather not vote at all! :rolleyes:

[||§§||RENÔTŠΩ]

What a waste of a vote! I'd rather not vote at all! :rolleyes:

:yeahthat: i think that might be the best vote yet

[||§§||Pinata]

Obama, The last thing America needs is another warmongerer

[||§§||Kit]

Obama, The last thing America needs is another warmongerer

LOL and if you own a gun there goes all your rights...

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

and Obama is not going to pull out of the middleeast guys. No president is going to, we can not, America would be horrible if we went in destroyed everything, and left, we are trying to rebuild everything over their and be a big brother protecting the government while it gets in place along with law enforecment over there, I work with a guy who is a captain in the army and was stations in Bagdad, helping teach their new police force. So we are not getting out of there anytime soon guys, no matter what you think Obama would do, he is just playing to what people want to hear while McCain is actually being honest and saying, "Hey, we can not, and are not going to leave."

[||§§||Pinata]

I don't really mind if McCain becomes president. But I just don't really feel like any war needs to come anytime after this one, And the guns thing... I'm going to make a thread about it now.

[||§§||Foehammer]

You know, I just love how the media slowly changed over the years. Back in 1942, if you bitched about the war, you were usually frowned upon and shot lol. Oh well, to be honest both of the presidents are just saying the same thing, I would've loved to vote for Zel Miller, but he chose not to run, and is really really old.

[||§§||Kit]

I think one could make an analogy between this war and the Vietnam war. I think we are trying to save face in both, and that's why we can't pull out of there yet...more thoughts to come on this...but I've been saying it for years now.

[||§§||Dr.H]

Vietnam sucked.. it was the first war that was broad casted in close to live time with almost no government involvement in what was shown to the American public.

The fact is we were winning that war by far but loosing it politically and the North Vietnamese knew that and used it to their advantage.

The world and is a tough place and I don't know how anyone can think that we can live without war.. You may think that certain people in the middle east right now should be left alone but guess what even if your supportive of them, they hate you for everything you are and would be more than happy to kill you and everyone else who they feel is against their beliefs.
The difference between us and them is we feel people can believe what they want as long as their not killing people or controlling them while doing it. We will fight wars to give people the freedom to make choices in their life.

[||§§||RENÔTŠΩ]

haha check this game out http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/459620
smack them around and see who wins :sFun_DeadHorse:
ive always wanted smack those bastards around now you can lol

[Nightmare]

haha check this game out http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/459620
smack them around and see who wins :sFun_DeadHorse:
ive always wanted smack those bastards around now you can lol

haha, that game is fun :p

[||§§||RENÔTŠΩ]

lol hell yea

[||§§||Dr.H]

http://www.vajoe.com/candidate_calculator.html WTF lol the first time it said I should vote for Nader, the second time Obama..

This doesn't help the fact I'm starting to freak out on who to vote for..

As for McCain well I don't agree with him in that I'm Pro Choice, I believe in separation of church and state and I'm against the no child left behind law. Ebryonic Stem Cell research sounds like a good idea to me and I could care less if gay people wanted to get married. Palin wants to teach Creationism in schools?? really?? Ok that's pretty much a deal breaker to me because it makes her look like a moron.

As for my disagreements with Obama.. I don't want the U.S. to be more like Europe! I don't want him to rebuild the military. Put a border fence up. There should be no path for illegal immigrants to become legal.. And the big one for me is DO NOT take away my right to own, carry or buy guns!

So am I screwed either way? I either have people making legal decisions based on religion or I loose my rights and guns? This blows!

Do I give up my right to protect myself and my country or do I give up my freedom to make my own choices ?

I respect McCain for being a war hero but I fear that Obama is pretty much a no one who came out of no where who has Hollywood, the media and celebrities support and gets a lot of money and influence from people not even in the U.S.. that's real scarry..

I don't mean to carry on but someone being in the middle and not agreeing with the far left or far right seem to be out of luck this election. Man I'm confused lol.

[||§§||Scorpion]

Im for MCcain,the hell with the other. Alot of the younger generation wants change and they listen to some wanna be MLK whos tells them what they want to hear and then they are on the bandwagon but when you ask people what he has done while he has been a senator,noone can answer that. lol

[||§§||Dr.H]

Kick ass sig Scorp!

At this point in time I think McCain is where my vote falls.. The person I currently worry about the most and the only one that threatens me directly is Obama. Even though I do not agree with a lot of the Republican beliefs I think when they actually get into office they will not do most of the radical things that all the hardcore Rep want them to.

[||§§||RENÔTŠΩ]

i think either way were getting screwed out of something or another. im still undecided, but whoever wins were gonna have an intresting 4-8 years

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

I am glad that both canidates seem like they will at least do a good job. I just seem to trust Mcain more. Obama seems to be going more for a popularity contest sometimes with the pandering on random primetime shows.

yes Mcain did go on Ellen, funny, strict republican being interviewed by a very gay women.

and I am anything but conservative, but Obama wants to withdrawl without setting up what is needed for Iraq to rebuild, and he would rather give a man a fish then teach him. (If you dont know that reference, read the bible or something)

[||§§||Foehammer]

Obamarama is muslim, which I find very interesting hardly anyone knows. He wants to take your money so he can "control it" for you. Like said before, Obamarama wants to pull out of Iraq, sit down and talk with Bin Laden, and kowtow to Iran. Fantastic.

McCain wants to give you your money, because its your money, which means Fair Tax has my vote. Mccain wants to rebuild the military and also build a fence, both I support.
Mccain gives the americans the truth, we can't pull out of Iraq anytime soon, we have a war to fight, and we have to end it now.

[||§§||Scorpion]

Foe is right but you will always have others that disagree. Noone loves war but its a necessary evil. If we run out of there and ry to have "pinky Promises" like Obama wants with the terrorists,then who wins? They do. Soon after we will be fighting them on our own soil.

I got this in an email and thought it was funny..

1.Obama is saying he will reform Washington!! NEVER HAS OBAMA BEEN A REFORMER OR PASSED ANY LEGISLATION TO REFORM GOVERMENT, IN FACT HE HAS OPPOSED REFORM WHEN POSSIBLE.


2. Obama is saying he will cut out Pork and Special Interest Groups. OBAMA ASKED FOR NEARLY $800,000,000 IN SPECIAL INTEREST PORK IN 143 DAYS AS A WORKING SENATOR.


3. Obama is saying he will have "transparency" in his administration. OBAMA HAS KEPT HIS LIFE A SECRET AND LIES ABOUT HIS VOTING RECORD AND HAS YET TO TELL THE PEOPLE ABOUT THE TRILLONS HE WANTS TO GO TO OTHER COUNTRIES..

1.
Occidental College records -- Not released
2.
Columbia College records -- Not released
3.
Columbia Thesis paper -- 'not available'
4.
Harvard College records -- Not released
5.
Selective Ser vice Registration -- Not released
6.
Medical records -- Not released
7.
Illinois State Senate schedule -- Not available
8.
Law practice client list -- Not released
9.
Certified Copy of original Birth certificate -- Not released
10.
Embossed, signed paper Certification of Live Birth -- Not released
11.
Harvard Law Review articles published -- None
12.
University of Chicago scholarly articles -- None
13.
Your Record of baptism-- Not released or 'not available'
14.
Your Illinois State Senate records--'Not available'
15.
Indonesian Passport records--Not released
16.
Adoption papers to Lolo Soetoro--Not released
17.
White Grandmother--unavailable and kept in hiding
18.U.S.
Citizenship record--Not released


Also, has anyone tohught about what may happen if Obama runs this country with his muslim background? We are friends with Israel and they are Jews..HELLO!!!! He may as well side with Lebanon and Hamas because he wouldnt be any different. Do you think that if Israel takes upon themselves to strike at Syria,Lebanon,or Iran,that he would step in and help protect Israel? Something to think about.

[||§§||Scorpion]

also on another note.. watch the difference on Obama to Mccain in these videos on when asked about Evil. Obama dances around the subject and stumbles. Mccain has his mind made up..this is only a question but remember about that one phone call a president may get to make a quick decision especially if we are attacked.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2TaGxB1n-U



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JhbEjPNAqs

[||§§||Dr.H]

Ok watching the debate last night was interesting.. They pretty much just say what they want no matter what was asked and give "statistics" on how the other side sucks. Lol everyone loves statistics.. :yawn: even if people don't know you can always bend or flex them to benefit your point of view.

That being said, what ever happened to non-biased news stations? The closet one seems to be Fox news everyone else is sooooo Pro Obama that they aren't even mentioning all the things factually wrong about what Biden said :shakehead:. I don't want them to be pro either side I only wish they treated both the same so everyone could decide for themselves.. a lot of people belive that what they see on msnbc and these other news stations is the truth when it's far from the truth.

It only shows that you Can Not trust what you see on the news be it points of view or polls.

[||§§||RENÔTŠΩ]

well i would hope mostly everyone would know that its not all trustworthy. but so true dude a non biased view point is hard to come by. and having a biased point and broadcast it is just another way to get more points for the election. no big its kinda how it all works, media will be media lol.its better to have your own opinion on this subject instead of taking it all from a news channel, if your interested enough to watch the news about it you must be interested enough to do your own research and make your own decision about the candidates its not even that hard.
I watched that debate too, it almost took everything out of me to watch it. and so true that they just said whatever the hell they wanted mainly to change the subject or procrastinate on the topic. no matter what, weaving through stupid people is almost impossible. now its like "you get what you get."

[||§§||Foehammer]

I love watching/listening to Glenn Beck and Bill O'Reilly, both are hotheaded people who love to speak their mind. If you get a chance, watch some of their shit.

[||§§||Stringendo]

What's the worse that can happen if either of these men get into office? Someone mentioned that if McCain gets in he won't do all those radical republican things people worry about. Either way I think things will be the same, not much better not much worse.

Is it really fair to assume to Obama magically will? If he's elected is it really going to be that easy for him to take your guns? What president would honestly 'sit down with Bin Laden'. He wants to get him just like any other American. I also don't think it's been proven that Obama is Muslim. He probably is. What's the downside of a Muslim becoming president. People assume he's going to light the country on fire. Like someone else said, he's not pulling out of Iraq, it's not that easy.

Some people here like Obama, McCain, or are undecided. So when you guys present this wild information like how much so and so is a liar or hiding information and it's all biased. If you disliked a candidate enough then you would invest time to find all the things wrong with that candidate while ignoring the other. Both of these guys have dirt on them, have contradicting political histories, and are not perfect. You can't hate them for that especially when they're trying to appeal to as many voters as possible.

McCain a war hero? So was Kerry and no one gave a damn. I don't think it has much to do with being president.

Palin is insane. When she was asked about abortion for girls who have been raped by their fathers she said the government would pay for their counseling. The whole hype about how much 'leadership' she has is BS because by the arguments people are making she' s actually more qualified than McCain.

I hate politics but it's always interesting to see these races which pull up all of our countries problems and ugliness to the surface. Elections are dirty and no one seems to be honest. I think if either person becomes president it won't make a difference (country will be divided with one side pissed). My opinion is that McCain is a republican and too much like Bush. The republicans had 8 years to show us what they got and I think the job they did wasn't too good. So the democrats deserve a chance to show what they've got at least for 4 years.

I mean that's the whole point of a two party system isn't it? Just to let you all know I'd like to see a democratic president for a change even if it is Obama. But I probably won't be voting because I don't really care and I don't think it makes a difference.

[||§§||Dr.H]

Your spot on in most points. Most of the crap we are being bombarded with right now are the same old hot topics that have been used in all the recent past elections.. and a large percentage of the time not a thing happens or changes once they get into office. Other than the economy I'm pretty happy with the way things are now.

My opinions are pretty much split down the middle with me agreeing with half the Democrats points or view and half the republicans.. to bad it's a two party deal because the independent guys could use a chance.
I might have given Hillary a chance, even though it was her husband who did the assault rifle ban but Obama lol not a fan.

Hmm or the perfect party would be a nonreligious republican party.

Who ever wins is going to be screwed anyway, especially the Democrats since people will expect them to fix the economy and we're going to have a couple years of resestion probably no matter what is done.

[||§§||Stringendo]

The economy is shot to sh!t there's not much we can do about it. There's going to be a lot of finger pointing at whoever becomes president and that just frustrates me. It's not something that will be fixed easily and by the next election you'll probably recover by then and everyone will say how bad X was as president and how great the new guy is.

Oh well

Dr. H, I'm cool with guns. I'm a fanatic even though I don't own one myself and I admit I'm not sure if we'd be better without them. There's too many iffy spots while a guy like you can definitely own whatever firearm you want and as many with no problem, other people shouldn't have them. So what's the determinant for deciding so? It goes in circles. But yeah guns are cool:thumbsup2:

[||§§||Dr.H]

;) While I myself don't own many guns and I'm not a hunter my father does and is so I want to support his rights more than my own in that area, though I have learned more about weapons and respect for them as I've grown older.

I completely agree with the current rules of background checks and no guns for anyone with criminal records.

[||§§||Dr.H]

See the SNL skit before it's banned again.

http://patdollard.com/2008/10/it-is-here-the-banned-snl-skit-cannot-hide-from-louie/

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

That was freaking AWESOME lol, also impressive that SNL actually made fun of Dems, usually they focus on Republicans, glad at least some times they can flip that camera around.

It is so true how they portray all the partis responsible for this screw up. and calling Soros the "Owner of the Democratic Party was perfect"

Here is the sad sad truth that some how keeps getting burried and never covered by the media.

YouTube - Shocking Video Unearthed Democrats in their own words Covering up the Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac Scam that caused our Economic Crisis

[||§§||Foehammer]

Something I read..

When put in context, Obama does indeed have many similarities with Hitler. Hitler himself was a mere "community organizer" in his attempt to gain power. He utilized his amazing talent to rally Germans behind him. Most didn't know what the heck they were getting into when they began to follow his lead during his trial for high treason.


It was Hitler's well publicized defense speech which brought him a broader coalition of supporters by denouncing communism and praising nationalism. His gift for incredible oration drew people to his side. He was a propagandist, and knew how to use propaganda to make people join him.


Like Hitler, Obama's well publicized "race relation" speech won praise from the masses who refused to see it for what it was - utter BS.


Like Hitler, Obama is a narcissist. Any first year psyche student could be able to distinguish that...

Obama is a rookie politician - you got that right - and so was Hitler. He was a military man, not a politician. Why don't you get your facts straight?! See, it matters not if someone is a rookie politician, what matters is that sheeple buy into someone's oratory skills.


Obama jet-sets around using his own "seal" like a dictator(cough Saddam too cough). Hitler called his first political campaign Hitler uber Deutschland(Hitler Over Germany). By jet-setting around and making a strong reference to himself in his campaign motto(seal, in Obama's case), Hitler managed to build himself up as a viable politician...just like Obama did to oust Hillary and rob her of "this was supposed to be Hillary's nomination.


Hitler was a product of a really bad upbringing, which, in today's world, would have Democrats screaming that he was a victim and proclaiming "it's not his fault he's like that". Dems would be demanding leniency for him in a court law and saying he should be held in a psychiatric ward instead of receiving the death penalty.


In similar fashion to Hitler, Obama denounces everything America stands for and gives praises of "hope, unity and change". Hitler also promised "hope, unity and change" for the Aryan German people in the sense of nationalism and socialism much in the same way Obama is putting forth his brand of socialism and Marxism. Furthermore, the way in which the messages were/are delivered are exactly the same. And if you can not see that, then you're just another sheep following the trend set by your "leader".


Do you want a president that takes speeches from Hitler? Do you want a president that spent his childhood growing up in Wasabi Shiite Muslim schools? You know the same schools today's terrorists attended. Do you want a president who is best friends with people who kill Americans? I know I don't. I'd rather have a war hero to America that had his bones broken in everyway, and still loves his country enough to continue to serve it, even though he cannot salute.

[||§§||Pinata]

Why does Mccain have a jawbreaker in his mouth?

[||§§||Stringendo]

Do you want a president that takes speeches from Hitler? Do you want a president that spent his childhood growing up in Wasabi Shiite Muslim schools? You know the same schools today's terrorists attended. Do you want a president who is best friends with people who kill Americans? I know I don't. I'd rather have a war hero to America that had his bones broken in everyway, and still loves his country enough to continue to serve it, even though he cannot salute.

What are you implying that Obama will plan a terrorist attack on America and invade Poland if he becomes President. Again, attending a Muslim school doesn't immediately make you a terrorist. "Best Friends" and "being associated" with someone should not be mixed up.

I'm saying this again: John Kerry was also a war hero and that never proved anything. McCain did a great service to this country but he was not a military leader which if he was would give him credentials for becoming one for this country.

Don't get me wrong I'm not defending Obama but I question the arguments people like to make against him.

I'm not a giant Democrat or Republican but I liked to understand both sides of the political war. Your points do make sense but I'm just trying to see what picture you're painting with them.

[||§§||Reign]

I am with the old Guy that wants to blow shit up! Besides if Obama is put in the white house he will Make us all pray at noon to the north! But he might not make it that long some one will kill him before he moves in to the white house. Sad but Does any one know Obamas Middle name. Its not a good one??? I know but do any of you?

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

I believe it is praying towards the East to Mecca.
Think if you pray towards the North it is to Santa.

Now I HEARD (Read:Rumor only) that Obama actually had talks about balancing the Nat Debt by "Renting out" our military to other countries, wants to units the US Canada and Mexico and have that AmeriEuro currency replace the Dollar. Some of that is not too bad if you think about it, but playing it out in my head I see what all bad movies and RTS game predict, 2 lage powers growiing, absorbing other countries until it is 2 or 3 and then horrible horrible wars (remember the game Risk :P)

OK dont know how much if any of that could even possibly be close to true but thought it sounded interesting.

[||§§||Foehammer]

What are you implying that Obama will plan a terrorist attack on America and invade Poland if he becomes President. Again, attending a Muslim school doesn't immediately make you a terrorist. "Best Friends" and "being associated" with someone should not be mixed up.

I'm saying this again: John Kerry was also a war hero and that never proved anything. McCain did a great service to this country but he was not a military leader which if he was would give him credentials for becoming one for this country.

Don't get me wrong I'm not defending Obama but I question the arguments people like to make against him.

I'm not a giant Democrat or Republican but I liked to understand both sides of the political war. Your points do make sense but I'm just trying to see what picture you're painting with them.


I didn't write it, obviously as I first said before poasting it, I read it simply. But to put that aside, from what I have seen and watched, whenever Obama goes to rally's he is mainly talking about McCain is bad, and how hope for change is good.

During those debates he just kept mostly agreeing with Obama and had little to say, so I took it from them.

Hand:

If Obama is really going to lend out our army for other nations to use, who knows what will happen. :eek:

[||§§||Stringendo]

I have to see about that renting our army to other nations thing. Isn't America always acting as the world police anyway and knocking dictators out of power? If Obama does indeed want to do that I think the logistics behind that are hard to imagine. In the state our military is in right now I don't know how you could hypothetically make a plan for renting our military out as if we had an excess of troops.

Let's also not forget that no matter who is elected and what you fear they will do, the president does not run the show by himself. There's congress and process that keep the president from being the "King of America" and saying oh we're going to do this and that and no one has any say against me.

I don't want to rag on Bush but perhaps some of his actions have clouded our judgment of how much power the president is actually allowed.

[||§§||Dr.H]

That's our main issue is that how it looks now Obama might win and with him he will have Democratic majority in House and Sennett.. What will be scary is that the checks and balances we're use to with mixed majorities will possible no longer be in effect.

I wouldn't be very upset either way if there was enough opposite votes to keep things the way they are but if things are in complete control of either party then there is nothing to balance the extremists of that party.

But since "Kings" are just figure heads these days I would say with obama "Socialist Dictator" fits better.

[||§§||Foehammer]

No but him holding power over Senate and House, and Supreme court justices, yeah...

[||§§||Dr.H]

Foe you're right about the Justices.. there is a number of Republican Judges that will be retiring in the next two years and those positions are set by the President and are lifetime positions not replaces by elections.. so that's not good.

I'm also disappointed in how much race has become an issue.. we all knew it would but it sucks.
I went to a very diverse school and had friends of every color so race has never bothered me to begin with.
I feel you should judge someone on who they are not what they are, so seeing so many people voting for Obama just because he's part black is just as disturbing to me as seeing people not vote for him because he is part black..

I know this clan doesn't tolerate any racism and I for one don't either. That stands for all forms of racism whether it be the crazy KKK guys or the well meaning NAACP I know that they mean to balance the unbalanced society we live in and that is a good thing but they often cross the line. Giving to or taking away anything to someone because of their skin color is racist and wrong.

I guess the fact is that life is full of double standards and there is an unlikely chance that will ever change.

[||§§||Foehammer]

Yeah its a sad fact of life, you can call someone the n word and be sent away to jail for 50 years for a hate crime, but 95% of the black community and most of the world are voting for him just so they can have "Change" in the office.

It sucks, no one really knows what he stands for, I've asked plently of Obama supporters, as have others.

Canada eh?

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

Of course this does not reflect ALL voters, but it is MUCH more important to be informed than it is to just vote,

An uninformed vote is a wasted vote.

***NOTE: This is a Howard Stern Clip, Strong Adult Language***

YouTube - Howard Stern - 1/10/2008 - Sal Interviews "Obama Supporters" in Harlem

[||§§||Stringendo]

Of course this does not reflect ALL voters, but it is MUCH more important to be informed than it is to just vote,

An uninformed vote is a wasted vote.

***NOTE: This is a Howard Stern Clip, Strong Adult Language***

YouTube - Howard Stern - 1/10/2008 - Sal Interviews "Obama Supporters" in Harlem (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5p3OB6roAg)

That was pretty interesting, Death, I totally agree that most people have no idea what they're doing. Race aside, I've always felt people generally vote based on the Party and the guy rather than politics. It's just like in a High School election.

Not directed towards Death, but I think its a cheap shot to prove the whole they're just voting for him because he's black thing by sampling black people from HARLEM? lol I mean what do you expect...

Anyone hear about Republican Colin Powell supporting Obama? Of course no one can take this man, who had done so much for this country seriously because he shares the same race as the candidate. Yet they disregard the 20-30 military leaders who supported Obama at the convention.

Ugh, the world is a dirty, dirty place. I can't wait till this ends and the American-Argue-Meter turns down from Civil War to insane.

[||§§||Dr.H]

Yeah I don't think the interviews in Harlem were meant to be to serious since on a whole I think(hope) most people are more informed than that.

The fact there almost no middle ground in this race I think is part of the reason people are arguing so much. Each person represents the extreme left or right side of their party, McCain is probably the less extreme of the two but still out there.
So I think the fact they are so extreme left and right it make the fanatical supporter of those views go even more crazy.. add in the biased media and Hollywood tossing fuel on the fire every day.. it makes it so even normal non political citizens don't have a clue what is real or fake or what is right vs wrong any more in this election.

I wish there was a reset vote so we could toss out the election and pick two new people to run.. at this point in time it's sad to hear myself saying it but I wouldn't mind Bush in office a bit longer, I'd rather have a dumb guy then someone who thinks he knows whats best for me.

[||§§||Hand_O_Death]

To just play devils advocate about the 20-30 military leaders voting for Obama, There are hundreds that are all backing Mcain, including the 25 (or so) men he would not leave behind as a POW when they told him he could go and he said he would not leave until all his men were returned to the US safely. I know its old news, but it really shows something to me personally about how he truly puts others before himself and can take responsibility for things.

[||§§||Stringendo]

That makes sense, Hand

I assume when you said hundreds of officers you meant throughout the military? To be fair I was just citing those at the convention we could assume the facts all day about how many officers support who.

I respect McCain's military career and I think it's an important sign of character. I've been whining about it a lot but Kerry was also in the war and no one seemed to appreciate it or deem it relevant. That being said although being in the military puts points in the McCain column it's hard to use it as a deal-breaker if someone were on the fence about who to vote for.

Obama wants to limit our presence in Iraq to an SF focus, and move over to Afghanistan. I doubt he'll be able to pull it off but from what I understand is this. Against the war = against our troops, For the war = for our troops. No one seems to allow a middle ground of supporting the troops by bringing them out.

I'll come clean and say that I believe we shouldn't have been in Iraq in the first place but now that we're there I don't think we can just 'go home.' But the problems Iraq faces aren't going to fade out just by having our military in the country. So what do we do? Go our stay it seems lose-lose to me.

[||§§||Dr.H]

Well add another terrorist friend to Obama's list of buddies.. LA Times anounced they had a video tape of Obama with a Palestinian terrorist... :shakehead: I don't understand how so many people in America don't mind all of these crazy anti-American friends Obama has. It's like he is above asking questions of or saying he is wrong.
The media is so one sided on the issue I doubt you'll even see close to as much coverage on this as you've seen on how much Palins new cloths cost..

Here is an article about it by Fox News who are the only people I give even a little trust to nowadays.


The Los Angeles Times is refusing to release a videotape that it says shows Barack Obama praising a Chicago professor who was an alleged mouthpiece for the Palestine Liberation Organization while it was a designated terrorist group in the 1970s and '80s.

According an LA Times article written by Peter Wallsten in April, Obama was a "friend and frequent dinner companion" of Rashid Khalidi, who from 1976 to1982 was reportedly a director of the official Palestinian press agency, WAFA, which was operating in exile from Beirut with the PLO.

In the article -- based on the videotape obtained by the Times -- Wallsten said Obama addressed an audience during a 2003 farewell dinner for Khalidi, who was Obama's colleague at the University of Chicago, before his departure for Columbia University in New York. Obama said his many talks with Khalidi and his wife Mona stood as "consistent reminders to me of my own blind spots and my own biases."

Click here to read the original LA Times story: 'Palestinians See a Friend in Barack Obama.' (http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-obamamideast10apr10,0,1780231,full.story)
On Wednesday, John McCain's campaign accused the newspaper of deliberately suppressing information that could establish the link between the Democratic presidential candidate and the former PLO spokesman.
"Khalidi was a frequent dinner guest at the Obama's home and at his farewell dinner in 2003 Obama joined the unrepentant terrorist William Ayers in giving testimonials on Khalidi's role in the community," McCain spokesman Michael Goldfarb told Florida radio station, Mambi. "The election is one week away, and it's unfortunate that the press so obviously favors Barack Obama that this campaign must publicly request that the Los Angeles Times do its job -- make information public."

Khalidi is currently the Edward Said professor of Arab Studies at Columbia. A pro-Palestinian activist, he has been a fierce critic of American foreign policy and of Israel, which he has accused of establishing an "apartheid system" of government. The PLO advocate helped facilitate negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians in the early '90s, but he has denied he was ever an employee of the group, contradicting accounts in the New York Times and Washington Times.
The LA Times told FOXNews.com that it won't reveal how it obtained the tape of Khalidi's farewell party, nor will the newspaper release it. Spokeswoman Nancy Sullivan said the paper is not interested in revisiting the story. "As far as we're concerned, the story speaks for itself," she said.

The newspaper reported Tuesday evening in a story on its Web site that the tape was from a confidential source.
"The Los Angeles Times did not publish the videotape because it was provided to us by a confidential source who did so on the condition that we not release it," the Times' editor, Russ Stanton, said. "The Times keeps its promises to sources."

In recent months Obama has distanced himself from the man the Times says he once called a friend. "He is not one of my advisers. He's not one of my foreign policy people," Obama said at a campaign event in May. "He is a respected scholar, although he vehemently disagrees with a lot of Israel's policy."
But on the tape, according to the Times, Obama said in his toast that he hoped his relationship with Khalidi would continue even after the professor left Chicago. "It's for that reason that I'm hoping that, for many years to come, we continue that conversation -- a conversation that is necessary not just around Mona and Rashid's dinner table ... [but around] this entire world."
A number of Web sites have accused the Times of purposely suppressing the tape of the event -- which former Weather Underground terrorists Bill Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn reportedly attended.

Sullivan said she would not give details of what else may be on the tape, adding that anyone interested in the video should read the newspaper's report, which was its final account.
"This is a story that we reported on six months ago, so any suggestion that we're suppressing the tape is absurd -- we're the ones that brought the existence of the tape to light," Sullivan said.
The Los Angeles Times endorsed Obama for president on October 19.
I think we're going to have to face the fact that we're probably going to have an anti-American President. I have no idea how that will work out..
Man I hate the guy and I'm not even a Republican.

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This whole William Ayers thing, I don't get what's the point of this guy. He's a terrorist is he not? Shouldn't he be in jail or something if he is as bad as everyone says he is? I'm not raising my William Ayers fan flag but I just keep hearing this guy's name like he's Obama's running mate.

As for this PLO story it's unfortunate that what is looking like our future president has such a shady background of friends. It's not hard to see where all this anti-American stigma is coming from. However, it'll be interesting to see how this plays out since Israel has long since been an ally of the US (we've supplied them with a lot of their military resources). You can only hope Obama is sincere when he says he only respects this man as a scholar. But if you don't trust or like a guy that's hard to do.

Leaders from our past all had links with 'terrorists' in the past. Look at George Bush, Donald Rumsfeld and Saddam Hussein. Who can forget that we funded and armed Osama Bin Laden in the 80s? These weren't even 'under the table' type dealings. Nelson Mandela, winner of the Nobel Peace Prize, as of early 2008 is still on our terrorist watch list.

It's all in perspective. 'Paling around' with these people of poor character will be looked at in the worst light depending on who you like. Since Obama had some general contact with these people, attended dinners with them, he their best friend, their supporters, an domestic and international terrorist to the extreme, when he's elected he's going to strap a bomb to his chest and take the White House down. His supporters will just pass off these contacts as superficial, insignificant, or whatever excuse works best.

Does anyone want to make a chart of 'American' friends of Obama in one column and his terrorists friends in the other. No, nobody reports on this majority because that's boring and not controversial. Negative press flies both ways, besides the constant showcasing of polls against McCain (which are objective to where they're being broadcasted anyway) I think McCain has had it rather easy. I have yet to hear any crazy McCain rumors similar to those against Obama. I wouldn't even be surprised if he won next week.

I'm not pointing any fingers here but how many of you believe Obama was born in Kenya, is a Muslim, and attended Muslim schools? He was born in Hawaii and attended Catholic schools growing up despite his parents both being Muslim, and has been attending a Christian Church for the last couple decades. Now how easy is that for you to believe? If you did not quickly pass that off as lies or at least said maybe that's true, it shows you can have a fair, open-minded view of this election with that mindset.

I don't think it's so much his race is why people don't like him but when you the Ayers association and the PLO association it definitely helps portray him as an 'anti-American.' If you had to define America as a race or what is a true American that image would most likely be a white person. A black person is American or at least 'African-American' but if you trace their lineage you're not going to arrive at one of the founding fathers or heroes of the frontier.

I wouldn't worry too much, guys. I know some people here are going to hate to have this guy in office but if he does anything crazy he can be removed and there are people that can oppose him despite out doubts. Congress may be ruled by democrats right now but they're not all 'anti-Americans.'

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William Ayers got away on a technicality because evidence was used improperly. In his own words "guilty as hell, free as a bird"

In the 80's the CIA did fund Afghanistan rebels to fight against the Soviet Unions invasion. At the time Osama was an outsider and no one of real importance. He didn't start to become who he was going to be until the end of the war. The worst thing about the support we gave them was that we armed them with misc non-US guns and finally US stinger missiles and at the end we bought a lot of them back from them.. what was that all about.
Our support was a known but not said thing same as them supporting northern Vietnam, it wasn't obvious we were supporting the rebels until Stingers started shooting down Soviet helicopters.

I don't think there are as many McCain rumors because the choices he has made in his life side more with what people term as ok or "American".
Lol are you suggesting it's ok for Obama to have terrorist friends because he doesn't have many and most of his friends aren't terrorists? That's not really making any sense.

I could care less about where Obama was born or his choice in religion since they're pretty much all the same to me. It's we're his beliefs are influenced by his religion that concerns me. The fact he spent years in Rev. Jeremiah Wright's church is not a point in his favor..

At this point in time I really wish Hillary had won't the Democratic Nomination.. The race would have been a lot cleaner and I might have actually voted for her.

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It's good that you don't base a candidate's qualifications on religion. Sad truth is many do. The qualifications for leadership are usually focused more on personality (and background of friends) than actually whether or not that person can run the country. Which confuses me because Obama has no 'executive experience' nor does it seem people approve of his personal life and decisions.

I should have worded the 'terrorist friends' paragraph better. I'm arguing on the case of the presentation of this information. Because he simply has known and ate/worked with these people means he is like them and shares their beliefs? The definition of 'friend' seems to be stretched in interest of McCain. At the same time why aren't we looking at some of Obama's real friends?

It's definitely not OK for him to be friends with him but is he really 'friends' with these people and for what reasons? I doubt they get together and play 360 on the weekends, eating Doritos and planning the destruction of America but I've been wrong before.

Hilary Clinton seems like a very strong candidate but I have no doubt she would have lost, not even close. People just didn't like her insert (X) reason here. The way the media was going at her back when she was a factor I think it would have been cool to see how much worse that would be if she were running right now.

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Well I had a short day at work so I picked up Resistance 2 on my way to vote.

I didn't have any wait in my town around 1pm but heard of people waiting 50min this morning in areas..
I also heard about Black Panthers were intimadating voters in Philadelphia.. One even had a night stick saying: "A black man is going to win this election no matter what" Wow check out that racism.. I'm hoping this isn't what really happened but there is no need for them to be there in the first place.. What the heck is happening in this country??

YouTube - Obama Black Panthers Intimidate Voters in Philly with clubs!

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The Black Panthers should be disgusted with those acts, I hope they would just support a democratic process that that gave a fair 50/50 chance of a man they want to be president.

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Well I had a short day at work so I picked up Resistance 2 on my way to vote.

I didn't have any wait in my town around 1pm but heard of people waiting 50min this morning in areas..
I also heard about Black Panthers were intimadating voters in Philadelphia.. One even had a night stick saying: "A black man is going to win this election no matter what" Wow check out that racism.. I'm hoping this isn't what really happened but there is no need for them to be there in the first place.. What the heck is happening in this country??

YouTube - Obama Black Panthers Intimidate Voters in Philly with clubs! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOtGllNk2Gk)

Will now we know how Obama won. Glad I didn't vote and run into those guys.

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Well the race was one sided from the get go. Obama had 90% of the media and Hollywood backing him so take into account how many young people mindlessly do and believe what they see is popular plus all of the people voted for him because he wasn't the old white guy and you can see how McCain had a huge uphill race. Even then the race was rather close.

Well all have to wait and see what happens.

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The only landslide victory was in DC with 93% to 7% the other races were very close usually about 55% to 45%. so even though the electoral said it was a far and away victory, it was much closer then we thought. But I am glad it is over and I can only pray that even with Democrats the majority everywhere that a real change will be made for everyone without raising taxes people that work for their money.

One thing I can say is that you will hear a LOT of the blame game towards the "Past regime" since they will not be able to blame anyone else with Democrats in all 3 areas.

Least we can lock this thread after today :)

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Well..I believe I shall take a hankering for pancakes and hockey. Eh?

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The only landslide victory was in DC with 93% to 7% the other races were very close usually about 55% to 45%. so even though the electoral said it was a far and away victory, it was much closer then we thought. But I am glad it is over and I can only pray that even with Democrats the majority everywhere that a real change will be made for everyone without raising taxes people that work for their money.

One thing I can say is that you will hear a LOT of the blame game towards the "Past regime" since they will not be able to blame anyone else with Democrats in all 3 areas.

Least we can lock this thread after today :)

I saw pretty big margins in California, New York...basically highly populated areas. What it all comes down to is city vs non-city, minority vs white, democratic vs republican etc. Which is why everything is so 50/50. I guess that's why we have an electoral college to make an attempt at avoiding biases like this.

Well the right, republicans, conservatives have had their 8 years with Bush, before that the opposition had Clinton, so the cycle just starts again.

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YouTube - The Red Army Choir

Our new anthem?

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OBAMA for WORLD PRESIDENT! LOL